A lot of people here have been asking about the derailment in East Palestine and want to know more about how this could happen. I work for Norfolk Southern, as a trainman so I can shed some light on some things. AMA. (whatever)
submitted by Aze to whatever 2.2 years ago
99 comments
I'll start with the question I've seen most, "What's this about the train ignoring several detectors and what cause this derailment"
All indications are that this was caused by a "hot journal" failure, more on that later. Apparently a doorbell camera saw the glowing hot journal pass by sometime before the derailment. No I don't have that video. Consider it hearsay for now.
The detector people have been asking about is referring to a "hotbox" detector. It scans the train for heat anomalies. Heat anomalies normally happen when a car has a handbrake that has been left on (happens all the time) or if the cars airbrake system "sets up" because of a bad valve or cold weather (this is also common). The reason the wheels get hot from this is because a brake shoe presses against the wheel to slow it, but if the engine is pulling the car with the brake applied the wheel will not normally completely lock up, so a lot of friction is the result. Friction = heat.
There is another way heat can be produced. If the "journal" or bearing assembly is damaged, worn, or maybe out of oil, it will also produce a lot of friction, way more then even a wheel with an applied brake would. This can and will get so hot that the steel can glow. One guy said he saw one 10+ years ago that was melting, like dribbling steel into the snow. This kind of thing isn't common at all, but we do hear of them once in a while. For example a massive derailment in Gary Indiana two years ago just before Christmas was caused by a hot journal.
The hotbox detectors scan for heat but sometimes the heat is minor. In these cases the detector doesn't trip an alarm or speak on the radio to the train crew, but instead the information is sent to the "wayside" desk in Atlanta to be monitored. This is called a trending hot, and typically the response is to just watch it and maybe set and release the trains airbrake to see if that breaks it loose.
In the case of the hot journal the temperature will normally but much higher. If the temperature is medium the detector will speak a non critical alarm on the radio, and the crew will then contact the dispatcher for instructions. It is normalish for the dispatcher to say "30 to the next" meaning 30mph max speed to the next detector. This is a lazy answer, and its is done because the dispatchers HATE stopping trains on the main line, but it happens every single day.
If the temperature is high the alarm will sound a "critical alarm, critical alarm". The train crew is required to bring the train to a complete stop and contact the dispatch and the moc desk for instructions. The rule book is clear when it comes to critical alarms, the car must be inspected before the train can continue to move, and then the car must be set out at the nearest location that can accommodate it. In practice this rule is follow 95% of the time, but its not impossible that the chief dispatcher could order the crew to move the train, or get it out of the way of some super hotshit train that is behind them. Its not right, but it does sometimes happen.
In this case, unless you want to conspiracy about it (possible but iffy in my mind) then I'd have to assume the hotbox detector didn't throw a critical alarm, and the crew was told "30 to the next". This tracks with the article I saw that said the train moved 20+ miles at "over 30mph". I'd guess over 30 just means 30 here, so ya, 30 to the next is the most likely.
The thing with hot journals is this, they don't necessarily get molten all at once. Very often a journal is maybe just warm to the touch for a long time, days maybe, because the damage inside isn't terrible. But as the metal warms, it expands, until at some point it expands so much that it wants to seize up. When this happens the friction inside goes through the roof and the heat goes with it. Its entirely possible in my mind that the journal in question was 350f when it went over that detector, it didn't bark a critical, and then just afterward it seized up and the temperature spiked until that fucker melted.
So there you have it. The truth, as far as I can tell. No propaganda, no BS.
The real question is how reasonable is it to believe it was DELIBERATELY made to fail to dump this shit on the Amish, or distract from, fuck take your pick, or just to plan fuck up the livestock and crops to further the food shortages.
Personally I don't like assuming that industrial accidents are foul play, normally I'd say corner cutting or incompetence. But that fucking White Noise thing... that is a fucking problem.
And don't forget, this isn't the only one of these right now. Once is unfortunate, twice is a coincidence, three times is enemy action. That's what they say.
I'm still not sure, but I'm suspicious as fuck.
I'm happy to answer any other questions, so fire away.
