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Is your wood stove efficient? (This is more important than you'd think.)

submitted by o0shad0o to Homesteading 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 09:35:50 ago (+51/-1)     (Homesteading)

tl;dr if there's smoke coming out of your chimney there might be a problem, and you should read more below.

When I ask if your wood stove is efficient, it's not to "save the planet". It's because if your stove isn't running right that means you're burning more wood and putting out less heat than you could, and you may also be depositing more soot in your chimney than you would prefer.

Cheap single-chamber stoves tend to be pretty inefficient. Properly designed double-chamber stoves, and most of the stoves on the market qualify even if the second chamber is small and not easily noticed, run IMO acceptably efficient. Catalytic stoves are even more efficient but the added expense is IMO not necessary.

First thing, you won't have no smoke at all coming from your chimney. All stoves will produce smoke until they get up to temperature. You want to get the stove up to its regular running temperature before you check the chimney.

White smoke from a wood fire is mostly methanol, with some ethanol and some other products. The second chamber of the stove is where unburned organic compounds will combust once that chamber is up to temperature. White or light gray smoke coming from the chimney means either the stove itself is inefficient, or you're not allowing enough air into the stove or enough airflow through the stove. There has to be enough oxygen coming in to fully combust the carbon in the wood.

Note that white clouds from your chimney aren't necessarily white smoke. It can also be condensing water vapor. Water is a product of burning hydrocarbons and if the humidity is high that water will condense once the stove exhaust cools down. High humidity in the environment will increase this effect. Look closely at the top of the chimney, if there's a clear gap between it and where the white clouds appear then it's water vapor. A lot of water vapor may also mean you're burning green wood, which isn't a good idea for various reasons.

Darker smoke means the materials you're burning aren't very appropriate for the purpose. I'd recommend switching to different materials, or different wood, to help keep from fouling up your stove.


39 comments block


[ - ] AugustineOfHippo2 6 points 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 10:16:25 ago (+6/-0)

Good info, thanks.
What's your opinion on rocket mass heaters?

[ - ] o0shad0o [op] 2 points 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 17:10:41 ago (+2/-0)

Not familiar with them. I'm assuming it's like a "rocket stove", with a space for the flames to form a vortex? Sounds interesting, but might not be as efficient as a properly enclosed stove that can restrict its air intake.

[ - ] AugustineOfHippo2 1 point 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 21:22:16 ago (+1/-0)

the idea is, you use all the heat possible from burning through the rocket stove to heat up some mass of rock or daub or whatever, then the mass will slowly radiate heat for hours. allegedly, you can burn very little wood, but the drawback is you need a mass of some material in the center of your house.

[ - ] PotatoWhisperer 0 points 2.2 yearsFeb 5, 2022 07:39:04 ago (+0/-0)

I'd be wary of the material used. Rock has a tendency to explode when heated.

[ - ] AugustineOfHippo2 0 points 2.2 yearsFeb 6, 2022 09:54:45 ago (+0/-0)

If you look at the design of the heater, it heats the mass up to 85 or 90 degrees, which would be far from explosion temperature. the idea is that it is a large mass that stores up the heat, and radiates it out over a long period of time, and only uses a small amount of wood to do it. the drawback, as i said, is the big mass in the middle of the room.

[ - ] account deleted by user 3 points 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 12:15:59 ago (+3/-0)

account deleted by user

[ - ] FalseRealityCheck 1 point 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 12:43:19 ago (+1/-0)

I'm interested in knowing more about these stoves. Do you have any links with which I can start my research?

[ - ] account deleted by user 2 points 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 13:07:03 ago (+2/-0)

account deleted by user

[ - ] FalseRealityCheck 1 point 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 14:05:26 ago (+1/-0)

Thanks for the info!

[ - ] SilentByAssociation 2 points 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 13:08:17 ago (+2/-0)

Do you have any experience with wood gasifier? That's something I've had interest in since about summer 2021.

[ - ] o0shad0o [op] 1 point 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 17:17:37 ago (+1/-0)

No, I do not. For those who don't know, a wood gasifier "cooks" the wood, heating it without supplying oxygen, and capturing all the byproducts. The main byproduct is methanol, wood alcohol, as I mentioned in the article. Actually, no, I'm wrong. The main byproduct is charcoal, which is what's left after the wood is done cooking. Producing charcoal the more traditional way winds up burning off all the methanol or just allowing it to escape.

Note that methanol is pretty toxic and you have to handle it properly. If you're immediately burning it off, it's as important to duct that outside as it is for a wood stove, and the less efficiently you burn it the more trouble you'll have.

[ - ] SilentByAssociation 1 point 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 18:45:12 ago (+1/-0)

I have a late family friend who used to make biodiesel, and he didn't take the precautions he should have. His health suffered in the last years of his life.

[ - ] o0shad0o [op] 1 point 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 19:04:01 ago (+1/-0)

I believe it. Be careful when you're denaturing organic compounds, you can wind up with some serious toxins.

[ - ] Belrick 0 points 2.2 yearsFeb 5, 2022 00:03:53 ago (+0/-0)

No.
Wood gasifiers produce hydrogen. That is the fuel mixed with oxygen and burnt.

Everything else is waste

[ - ] o0shad0o [op] 0 points 2.2 yearsFeb 5, 2022 09:31:03 ago (+0/-0)

Hmmm...

Most of the documentation on the net says the primary flammable product is hydrogen, but I'm skeptical. I wouldn't think you'd get a lot of hydrogen out of it unless you kept it fully enclosed and at high pressure until you reached that point. You'd get lightweight hydrocarbons, methane/ethane/propane/butane, some alcohols, but breaking those gasses (at that temperature) down before they left the chamber, as I said, you'd have to keep them there and keep them hot.

[ - ] Hadza 0 points 2.2 yearsFeb 5, 2022 05:33:40 ago (+0/-0)

Check this one out. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rbjey5RGx3c
If you need any translations, ask away.

[ - ] Qwertytoal 2 points 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 12:22:17 ago (+2/-0)

Good rule of thumb is the more time the wood smoke spends within the stove the more efficiently it will be burnt of all carbons and soot and the cleaner your smoke emanating from the chimney will be.

[ - ] o0shad0o [op] 0 points 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 17:13:21 ago (+0/-0)

Mmm, yes and no... If the smoke stays in the stove longer at a cooler temperature than another stove with a smaller secondary chamber that's heated by the direct fire more effectively, I'd still pick the 2nd stove. The stoves made from two barrels are suspect IMO. But there's an easy way to tell; how much smoke is coming out of it?

[ - ] 1Icemonkey 2 points 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 10:26:34 ago (+2/-0)

I have a pellet stove and it’s way better than a wood stove. However, it requires electricity.

[ - ] Native 5 points 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 11:49:06 ago (+5/-0)

Problem with pellet stoves is you have to buy pellets. With supply chain issues I’m sure you’re seeing how that is an issue

[ - ] Cantaloupe 0 points 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 13:29:39 ago (+0/-0)

Are the pellets corn? That's going to be an issue. Corn has become uneconomical to grow. Farmers are switching to soy.

[ - ] o0shad0o [op] 1 point 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 17:14:08 ago (+1/-0)

The pellets are made from compressed wood. But it's not something you can easily make for yourself. Lose your supply of pellets and you're going to go cold.

[ - ] Native 1 point 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 19:10:48 ago (+1/-0)

No my point remains. Unless you live in a desert there is always wood. Can’t do that with a pellet stove

[ - ] 1Icemonkey 0 points 2.2 yearsFeb 14, 2022 21:51:39 ago (+0/-0)

Extruded doulas fir sawdust.

[ - ] 1Icemonkey 0 points 2.2 yearsFeb 14, 2022 21:50:38 ago (+0/-0)

It’s not an issue when you live on the same coast as where the pellets are milled, but yeah, might could be a thing.

[ - ] Steelerfish 0 points 2.2 yearsFeb 5, 2022 22:32:37 ago (+0/-0)

Yet another reason I live in the free state of Florida….
(And then there’s the other 8 months when we are sweating off our well sunned balls in the sauna with severe t-storms every day at 3:00)

[ - ] CPU 1 point 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 11:23:06 ago (+1/-0)

What are your thoughts on coal stoves? Coal is decently cheap in volume and puts out high heat, but it does have some heavy metals.

[ - ] SparklingWiggle 3 points 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 11:57:30 ago (+3/-0)

Don't burn the coal.

Plus, you can't cut down a coal tree.

[ - ] o0shad0o [op] 1 point 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 17:20:56 ago (+1/-0)

The ash is more toxic than that from wood, so you'll need to handle that more carefully. Also do not burn coal in a wood stove; further, do not burn coke in a coal stove. (It will melt.)

I mean, if you have a decent source, and can put a bit away for a rainy day, sure. Make sure you handle the ash properly, don't use it on your garden (which you can do with wood ash), and if your sanitation department is okay with hauling the ash off, awesome.

[ - ] mannerbund 1 point 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 10:49:32 ago (+1/-0)

Also, if you can, get a wood stove with 'after burners' where air is injected into the burn chamber just before the exit. When burning wood at sufficient temperature, the wood will vaporize from the bottom with ghost blue flames, and if you look above to the air ducting, you'll see your fire up there. The wood is being burnt on the way out and the burn time of the wood seems to go up notably at that stage.

[ - ] AugustineOfHippo2 1 point 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 12:42:47 ago (+1/-0)

A.k.a. gassification

[ - ] mannerbund 0 points 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 13:32:38 ago (+0/-0)

Neat, exactly that.

[ - ] 2Drunk 0 points 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 18:07:19 ago (+0/-0)

Wood burning stoves or fireplaces have been illegal for years because a certain race burns trash.

[ - ] o0shad0o [op] 0 points 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 19:02:46 ago (+0/-0)

Wat. That's a crock of shit. Might be in your locale, or they may require catalytic stoves, but that's not true in most of the US.

[ - ] 1234567890 0 points 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 13:05:09 ago (+0/-0)

Great post.

[ - ] StanFartsteinberg 0 points 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 10:56:26 ago (+0/-0)

What about burning wood pallets?

[ - ] SparklingWiggle 0 points 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 11:59:37 ago (+0/-0)

A lot are made from hardwoods, but you want to toss out the pine which is often the stringers. I've also heard some can be sprayed with a chemical, but I haven't looked into it further.

You can use the fingernail test for hardwood. You can make an indention with you nail in softwoods, but not in hardwoods.

[ - ] deleted 0 points 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 10:50:46 ago (+0/-0)

deleted

[ - ] PostWallHelena 0 points 2.2 yearsFeb 4, 2022 10:34:55 ago (+0/-0)

Thanks for the 411 on smoke.